What did we not talk about? An honest conversation (podcast) with One Single Woman

I am back in the US (more on that in a future newsletter). On this (American) Mother’s Day morning, I want to share with you a podcast that I recorded back in late December. 

When Pippa Brown, the creator of One Single Woman podcast, reached out to me, I said yes because she was friendly and enthusiastic, two qualities I always love in a person. I could tell that she had found a soul mission in this project.

She released this episode on February 14 (Quirkyalone Day!) but that was the day I was leaving for Istanbul. Then I was out of the country until last Saturday.

The whole time I was away, I remembered I had this podcast to share with you. I was waiting for the right moment. It’s now! Mother’s Day! Because we talk quite a bit about the decision to be a mother, or not. This decision weighed heavily on me for years as I was out in the wilds dating and looking for a life partner, and I know the weight of this decision does for many people, even if the yes or no is clear.

Sometimes the good stuff takes a while to get out there just because I want to let these deep conversations soak into me. Then I figure out how to share with you, because honestly, as I have gone deeper into the layers of writing a memoir (the ultimate training ground for honesty), this process has spilled over to the degree of disclosure that happens in these interviews.

Sometimes to the point where I listened to the recording, and thought, damn did I say that? 

This podcast goes into a lot of soul questions that may be valuable for people who are asking questions about:

  • Becoming a mother, or not
  • Keeping our sexual energy alive: How do we not just let ourselves die on the vine if we are single for years, or in a sexless marriage?
  • How do we deal with feelings about aging?

So I took the time to get the whole thing transcribed and then fix up the transcription, because I really like all we covered. I will cherry-pick and highlight aspects of this conversation in future newsletters, because truly, we just got so honest it is worth sharing.

We will both love to hear your reactions.

So give yourself a nice hour to do the dishes and listen, or lie on your couch and listen

If you have never listened to a podcast in your life, give yourself a new experience.

The conversation continues in the comments. Let us know your responses!

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Here is the transcript from this fabulous conversation…with links to some of the resources mentioned.

Hello, and a massive warm welcome back to One Single Woman. 

Now, today may well be Valentine’s Day, but it’s also National Quiirkyalone Day. Quirkyalone is a movement which was founded at the beginning of this century, and it spreads the important message of self-acceptance and living life on your own terms regardless of your relationship status.

My guest today is the awesome Sasha Cagen. Sasha is an American author and the founder of this movement she wrote Quirkyalone: A Manifesto for Uncompromising Romantics back in 2004. She’s also written To-Do List: From Buying Milk to Finding a Soulmate, What Our Lists Reveal About Us and she’s currently working on her new memoir Wet.

Alongside writing Sasha works as a life and executive coach specializing in empowering women who are 40-plus to create turned-on lives, careers and businesses.

We discuss so many topics during this interview, we talk about being quirkyalone and whether a romantic relationship is a want or a need. We discuss Sasha self-marriage, her thoughts on not being a mother, and how she has listened to her bodily intuition to help her make important decisions in life.

We also discussed the empowerment of pussywalking, which Sasha invented and she now teaches to both women and men, and we dive into the topic of sex when you were a single person.

I do just want to mention that Sasha does touch on childhood sexual trauma. We don’t go into any detail but it is mentioned a few times during the course of this interview. 

And there are parts of this conversation which would not be suitable for children to listen to. Right. I really hope that you enjoy this conversation. Let’s go.

Hello, Sasha and a very warm welcome to One Single Woman. Thank you so much for being here with me today.

ABOUT QUIRKYALONE

Now you are the author of the book Quirkyalone, which is a concept which absolutely fascinates me. Could you please give some background about Quirkyalone, or where the concept initially came from?

Quirkyalone has been around for a while now because we’re almost at the end of 2023. I came up with “quirkyalone” back in 1999. So we’re talking about 24-25 years ago, which is like pretty insane to think that’s like half of my life.

So basically, it’s a concept that I came up with when I was in my mid-20s. I had spent most of my life single by then. I was still a very young person. 

I always felt like something was weird with me. You know, even going back to being 13 because I didn’t always have a boyfriend. Quirkyalone was a creation of mine to create a word to describe people who don’t settle in relationship, who want to be in a relationship, but may spend a longer period of time single versus others who more quickly find someone to couple up with. 

So I wrote an essay and published it in my own magazine To-Do List at the time and Utne Reader which was a magazine that published selections from other magazines. Utne reprinted the quirkyalone essay back in 2000. 

Then it was going viral before things went viral. This was very dawn of the Internet. Yeah, it just got this tremendous reaction from human beings all over who were inundating me with mixtapes and letters and letters from prisoners, and it was really quite a phenomenon.

This was way before it was so common for things to go viral. So it was like coming-to-my-post-office-box-viral. That led to interest from an agent which led to me writing a book that came out in 2004. And then when the book was published, Quirkyalone got a lot of media attention as a different spin on being single. And it really kicks off a lot of conversation that continues to this day. About different ways of looking at being single and being in a relationship because Quirkyalone has these other sort of fun identities inherent in the book like quirkyslut, and quirkytogether. And so it’s not really about being single. 

Ultimately, it’s about being true to yourself, and a kind of recognition that for some of us being true to ourselves, may mean a whole bunch of time of being single, but it doesn’t mean that that is always the first choice or uncomplicated. But it really gives people a feeling of validation to know that they’re not the only ones who are having that experience. Because at so many points in our lives, we can wind up feeling like something’s wrong with us if we don’t have a partner.

I took your quiz, Sasha, in the book, and yeah, it totally resonated with me. I came up like that. I’m very quirkyalone. 

Can you just tell me, what about the ratio of men to women reaching out to you?

I have always heard from men and women. I’ve done polls of the community over the years, and it’s been pretty consistent. 85% women, 15% men. I haven’t done one in the last few years, but I did want another one five years ago, and it was still like that. So I take that as a pretty consistent number.

You have, well, more women are always interested in self-development, and trying to understand themselves. Perhaps the percentage of quirkyalone men has grown or you know, maybe they just weren’t finding me. 

Of course, women face more stigma about being single, but men have their own struggles. 

I definitely have men who reach out and feel very identified with being quirkyalone. 

It’s not actually a concept of wanting to be alone full stop. It is that thing of being open to a relationship. In chapter four in your book, you said when “settling is not an option,” so it’s very much geared towards being open to a romantic relationship and even marriage, but it’s the concept of not settling for something that isn’t right for you. 

Yeah, I think that that’s what is inherent to quirkyalone is that kind of allergy. Settling is just not really an option. Of course, as one gets older one thinks a lot about, What does it mean to settle? Because you know, if you’re going to try out different relationships, it’s not like ordering a product on Amazon. You can’t necessarily get the one with the specifications that you want.

But I think that we learn that we can settle on the most important things and I would say that’s going to be different for each person. I mean, for me, what’s most important is not settling on how I’m treated. 

For other people like it could be about living situations. They want to have a committed deep relationship with someone but they want to keep living on their own. Alone can be quite troublesome for people. One really lovely man that I coached to was, I don’t know, maybe upper 50s. He really believed that all women would need to get married or live with him if he was going to have a relationship with them. 

Our work was sort of about opening up to the possibility that there could be another quirkyalone woman out there who had the same desires for a strong relationship without cohabitation, necessarily. Many things are possible when you are quirkytogether. 

ABOUT BEING BORN OR MADE AS A QUIRKYALONE

I’m just gonna go to your chapter in the book called “Born or Made?” This is something that I really resonated with. So I’m just going to read out just read out a paragraph here. 

“I call myself a “womb quirkyalone,” because even though intellectually I know that my quirkyalone status must be a complex combination of innateness and experience, it feels innate.

I cannot imagine being any other way.”  Can you just speak more to that for me?

I love that you’re reading from the book. It’s so wonderful for me because I’m like, Who wrote that?

When I wrote the book, it was clear to me that there were people who felt like they had come out of the womb quirkyalone. This is always the way they were. 

And then there were people who came to this realization through life, you know, through a divorce or relationships that sucked the life out of them, or whatever. 

Circumstances prompted them to have a quirkyalone awakening, realizing that it was possible to have a full existence on their own, they would prefer to not settle and you know, be selective and cultivate enjoyment on their own.

For me, it’s one of those funny things because it feels so inherent to who I am. I guess that the circumstances that led me to feel like I’m a “womb quirkyalone” are that I grew up in a town where there were just there was just no one for me to date. You know, I mean, I remember feeling that way. In junior high school. In high school I was really excited to go to debate team meets at another high school, or math team meets at another high school, or the fantasy that my parents would be able to send me to boarding school and I would meet my boyfriend there. 

I had friends. I had a group of female friends who were very tight, but there was nobody for me to date. And so I think it was true then.

I don’t think I was wrong. I think it was accurate as a teenager, because now when I’m living where I grew up, I mean, it’s rare to find someone that I connect with. And, of course, when I went to college, it was true that there were more people that I could see as potentially compatible. And, you know, then I went on and lived in cities that had a lot more dating potential.

But I think that the part of that wombness was also my strong friendships. I always had best friends. I structured my life with groups of friends. 

And I think that there is a difference for a lot of people when they look back at their early lives. Were their early lives shaped by friendships, or by having a boyfriend or girlfriend, or whatever?

For me, I really learned that I could get along with friends and that actually, having a partner is something I deeply want and value. I love being in a relationship. I love sex. I love the challenges that come up in relationship. I’m a relationship geek. I like reading relationship books and taking relationship seminars and I love all of that. I love having those problems to solve. 

But the bigger crisis for me is not having any friends. That’s when actually life is at a crisis point. When I moved to  Buenos Aires  when I was 38, I was living in a city with no friends. That was actually far more uncomfortable for me than not having a boyfriend.

As a quirkyalone, I know very well, how to get along with two or three friends. To do things locally with and not have a boyfriend. I mean, that’s kind of the status quo. It’s okay. It’s not a crisis. It’s not an emergency in the way that not having friends is an emergency. 

ABOUT TURNING FIFTY – AND THE QUESTION, AM I STILL A QUIRKYALONE?

And going back, Sasha, so obviously, this was, this was 25 years ago, as you said, do you still feel it sort of inside? Do you still feel like the same person with regards to the whole quirkyalone thing has or has it has it evolved for you personally, in any way?

Yeah, I actually have an essay that I started to write during the pandemic.  I just went back to it to think like, can I shape something from this? The title of the essay is, “Am I still a quirkyalone?” (NOTE: this essay is still coming. Be sure to sign up for the newsletter to get it when it’s ready.)

This is a live question for me. Am I still a quirkyalone? And it’s something that I have answered differently even in the last two years.

I keep changing my answer. I think in some way I will always be a quirkyalone because for me being quirkyalone really has nothing to do with being single. I could be married and living together with someone and being a stepmother. I’m just sort of creating a scenario, because I’m not going to be a mother at this point. That train left.

I could have all of those choices set up that would look on the outside traditional and still be “quirkyalone,” because being quirkyalone is this sort of inner flame inside that recognizes that I can have a satisfying existence in a number of different ways. 

Being with the right person who feels internally like a match to me is non-negotiable. That’s just not going to change, that not-settling thing. But I think what I have struggled with as a question many times over the last 10 years, let’s say, is the question of is a romantic relationship for me as a want or a need.

As I have gone through my personal process with that, I have had someone suggest to me well, “Maybe this is a need for you. And you should treat it more seriously as a need.” And not just as sort of icing on top which is the way that I had talked about it like, yeah, I can be perfectly happy and if I have a great relationship, that’s the icing on top of the cake. Is it actually a need for my life, to be in a good relationship? 

In a way, I liked declaring it as a need because it was like yeah, I’m a human being. This is actually a part of me that really wants to be expressed. I really wouldn’t be satisfied with my life without sexual intimacy, without emotional intimacy. I guess at the end of the day, trying to have what I want. I can’t say that I’ve been successful in finding a really long-term (romantic) relationship in the last 10 years. I’ve been in relationships. Now where I am, I don’t have that.

And then I started to think years later, this need thing. It’s kind of a downer. It’s actually not making me feel good to think that way. 

I myself have been going through a sort of awakening and revival. Yeah, appreciating all of the amazingness that is in my life. Turning 50 was really a big part of this. Because actually being single at 50 was a huge fear of mine. Like it had been in my psyche of like, I don’t know, somehow 50 was worse than 40 for being single. And 40 is when I married myself.

But, of course 50 is harder than 40. I think every every decade as you get older, it’s a little bit more serious because it’s like, I’ve lived longer, and there’s more to contemplate. There’s less time and I want to be really intentional about how I am living my life to suck the most juice out of life. 

I have been going through a really interesting period, the last few months of really appreciating how amazing my life is actually. Somebody was asking me if I was happy when I turned 50. And I was like, “I think I’m happy.” And he thought that that was kind of funny. “I think I’m happy” was almost like a comedy line. And I realized that I was holding a back on saying I was happy because I wasn’t I didn’t have the relationship piece that I wanted.

I had this deep thing inside me that said, You can’t say you’re happy because if you do, then you’re never going to get what you want. If you say you’re happy, this is really weird, but I’m admitting this because I wrote Quirkyalone, but I realized that that was still hanging out there.

And so then I really started talking about that with all of my a lot of my friends who are in relationship and how I compare my life to them to them.

I was really doing myself a disservice. Actually I am happy. There’s something about getting to 50, which is like, Wow, this is a lot of hard work turning 50. But I can see the view better. 

A friend of mine was like yeah, it takes 50 years to figure out how to live. I feel like I’m getting there. 

FIfty sparked a lot in me because I wasn’t even sure if I was going to talk about it publicly. That’s a whole other topic about age discrimination and all of those things, but through this reckoning and reflection process, the things that have become clear to me are I am going to talk about being 50 because I have wisdom to share from growing older and especially as it relates to being single. Because this was my biggest boogeyman, being single at 50. 

Now I’m living with it and I’m like oh my life is actually awesome. I was just in Bali. I’m going back to Bali. I’m going to Turkey soon. I’m dancing tango all over the place. My business is a lot of work but it’s growing. I’m creatively expressed. I love this new home that I managed to purchase. I didn’t know that I would ever purchase a home as an artist-healer person. So I’m like wow, you know, actually, it’s okay to say that I’m happy.

It really seems odd that I’m saying this but like is it’s been a really profound thing. 

It sounds like it has but I’m so pleased to hear that you that that’s how you feel that 50. That’s, that’s wonderful. It’s really inspiring. 

Yeah, it really is. And I don’t say that lightly because I was terrified of it. 

There’s a lot of weight that goes along with age. There’s a lot of discrimination. There’s a lot of negative feelings about what it looks like to be in your 50s. 

A lot of my work with tango and the Tango Adventure I used to host in Buenos Aires. It was a lot about showing women a different culture where women in their 60s and 70s are still wearing sequined dresses and going out to dance until 2 am or 4 am. Yeah, any night of the week or you know, that it’s possible to keep living an engaged, sexy life. 

MOTHERHOOD – AND NOT-MOTHERHOOD

Sasha you mentioned children I want to eat would you be happy to talk about about the fact that you don’t have any children and how that sort of looked for you throughout your life?

So the question about children was a big one for me, because I was one of those people who was open-minded about it. And I always thought that if I met the right partner and we got into a serious relationship, that child would be a product of that love.

I did have a gay friend who talked to me at 27 about having a child together if it didn’t work out, you know, in a regular kind of way.

So that question between 35 and 40 was a really big one. For me of you know, will I meet someone? And what choices am I making in life to support or not support, finding a partner and having a child? So it was tough and you know, I’ve coached a number of women through, I call it a dark passageway of being a woman. I think that those ages between 35 and 40 are really tough in a way that isn’t generally recognized because there are biological limits for women and for men too, which people don’t like to acknowledge.

So for me personally, I never felt it like a kick in the stomach of something that I just absolutely had to pursue. I think a lot about decisions because when you are a single woman your life doesn’t follow a regular template. You have the potential to make a lot of decisions about how your life can be and how you use the time and freedom that you have. 

So let’s say I had a kick in the stomach that told me I had to go back to Buenos Aires and dance tango. That was a choice point that I mean, when I was 38. Do I want to stay in the Bay Area, San Francisco, where I was very unhappy, and continue to date, online dating, and maybe I would meet someone? Or do I want to listen to my bodily intuition, that kick in the stomach that is saying you have chronic fatigue syndrome, and the thing that is going to help you is going back to Argentina and living there for a while?

I really struggled with that decision. Ultimately, I listened to what my pussy had to tell me and that’s a story that I’m telling in Wet.

We’re going to get onto that. [Laughter]

When I coach women, I help them figure out how to listen to their pussies for their decisions.

But yeah, my pussy pulsed. My pussy had a pulsing sensation that said yes, go. So I clicked buy on a ticket that I had been struggling to buy. And lo and behold, I moved to Buenos Aires. 

That was back in 2012. And I wound up being there for eight months that time. I came back and I think that after that I kind of had let go of the child dream.

Of course, I think it is around 42 or 43 that one really has to let go because it (having a child) might seem possible until then. So it was this kind of gradual letting go of that as a possibility. I do have to say there was something really good about that of the freedom on the other side. Okay, fuck it. That didn’t happen.

I feel really lucky that I don’t have a terrible grief about that. I think you know Jody Day who created Gateway Women. She helps women who feel that grief. Tthat’s that’s a huge emotional process to let go of, when you when you had more desire than ambivalence. I would say I had more ambivalence than desire.

Because now, to be quite frank, I’m pretty relieved that I don’t have children. I mean, when I look at the news headlines I’m really glad I don’t have to worry about my kids. I also feel that I am a maternal person who’s very loving and caring. When I was 35 to 40, I really had this fear that if I wasn’t a mother, I wouldn’t be a complete woman. Even though intellectually, I wouldn’t have told you that, that fear was running me.

I don’t have that anymore. I feel totally like a woman. I don’t have to be a mother. And I’m very conscious of all the ways that one can be motherly in the world. And like when I run my coaching programs, and I do things for others, I feel like I’m expressing that part of myself that is nurturing. Of course I have parents to care for and other people to care for. So I really feel like I’ve gotten a lot of freedom, as I’ve gotten older, to get out of those structures that are implanted in us that like, you know, to be a woman you have to be XYZ. I have a much broader idea of what being a woman is about now, or let’s say being a loving adult.. A loving, nurturing adult.

And I feel that yeah, I’m doing a good job with that. I can be an emissary of getting older as a good thing. 

Yeah, that’s such a lovely way to put it. You know, you’re you’re nurturing in other ways. It doesn’t have to be towards the child does it? 

Yeah, I heard things like that many times as I was going through those decisions, but it wasn’t until I fully felt that myself and stepped into a much more objective view of myself with more self-respect and stepped out of those narratives that it’s actually been really great. I’ve talked to other women about this, too. There is something good about getting beyond that biological clock window and feeling the freedom of not having that pressure anymore. 

IS THERE A STIGMA AROUND NOT HAVING CHILDREN?

And with regards to pressure did you feel have you felt throughout your life stigma surrounding the fact that you didn’t have children?

You know, I feel that stigma when I’m in settings where everyone else has children. I don’t know if it’s stigma, it’s just feeling weird.

For example, I facilitate groups of executive women for a company called Chief. Sometimes I’ll have a group and they’ll be some single women or some non-mothers, and sometimes they’ll be all mothers. 

Unavoidably one is going to feel a little alien and foreign, because let’s say we do we do an exercise in the first meeting where people write a timeline of their lives, the important events in their lives. So for them, the wedding, the birth of the child, other things that happen like they’re shaping events and their lives. When you don’t have that, and you’re presenting a timeline, it’s different. It does take strength just to say like, yes, my life is different than the norm. There are other meaningful moments. It’s a little bit vulnerable to step out and say, like, oh, yeah, this time when I ran away to Brazil, that was really meaningful for me, because, you know, maybe they’re gonna think that’s very superficial or not as important as having a child or something like that. So I don’t know if that’s stigma, but insecurity.

I’ve been really lucky in my life to surround myself with open-minded people. Being an expat is excellent for a person who doesn’t fit the norms because expats by their nature don’t. When I lived in Buenos Aires for six years, one of the best things about it is that my friends were people who also left their countries of origin. They were entrepreneurial, they were creative. They’re doing something different with their lives. That really helps. 

If you are around everyone else doing the expected stuff, I think it’s a challenge. But also the people who do the expected stuff, they have their own questions. It’s so interesting being a coach because I hear from people who are clients, who did all of the expected things, and then they’re wondering, did I really even want any of this? Like, you know, maybe I was just following along with what society wanted from me. 

I would say that being a life coach and having so much access to what’s really going on for people has been very helpful for me in my own personal journey because it helps me see that I have been quite intentional. And it’s not like I just did some like paint by numbers. A strength of my life is that it has been chosen.

WHAT IS SELF-MARRIAGE, AND WHAT IS SOUL COMMITMENT?

Thank you for sharing that. Thank you. Now, you did just briefly touch on this idea that you married yourself. Could you just tell us why that was and what that looks like for you?

I married myself when I was 40. I did it in Buenos Aires because I felt more comfortable there, but I had tango friends who joined in the ceremony.

I learned about self-marriage when I wrote Quirkyalone. In that book, there are some interviews with women who married themselves. Self-marriage always seems to be this concrete, artistic manifestation of the ideals of Quirkyalone. You’re committing to love yourself and honor yourself as you would hope a partner would.

It didn’t really make sense to me personally until I was around 40. I had been doing a lot of healing work. There was sort of deep stuff that I had to reckon with from my past that actually was childhood trauma, sexual trauma that happened that I had never addressed and that’s really the story that’s underneath Wet. The stuff that had not been looked at and dealing with it.

So I had been going through that process, which was very difficult. I guess I was thinking a lot about my shadow because I was thinking about shame and aspects of myself that were difficult for me that I didn’t want to talk about or that I didn’t want to have known by a partner or family. Ways that I kept myself hidden. 

I’d been doing all this therapeutic work. Suddenly the self-marriage idea felt like a way to take all this work I had been doing in therapy and do something with it in a kind of celebratory way, to commit to loving all parts of me. Jung has been important in my work. I talked about Jung in the first quirkyalone essay. My work has a lot to do with overcoming shame, healing shame. And for me, this self-marriage was a ritual of healing shame, and stepping into acceptance of all of me.

I did it with two tango friends, one from Colombia and one from Estonia. The one from Colombia had already married herself very casually like a year before. She just went out and bought a ring. And that was that. 

And then the friend from Estonia was younger and it didn’t make sense to her at the time. But she actually married herself after having two children and divorcing. She went back and married herself in Estonia years later and became an advocate in Estonia on TV for self-marriage. 

So it was a very quirky group of women and the three of us we did it in the Japanese Gardens in Buenos Aires. It was very peaceful. I wanted something very peaceful. You see a lot of media pictures of self-marriages where they’re big. The woman is wearing a white dress and you know, there’s 100 people there. This was not my style. I don’t think I want that if I get married to a man. I like small things. I’m a highly sensitive person.

It was a very small ceremony. We had sushi afterwards. We spent the day together. 

I think what’s really beautiful about self-marriage is that when you’re in the presence of someone who’s doing a self-marriage ceremony it’s very uplifting to everyone because you’re on this channel of self-commitment.

I’ve been calling it soul-commitment. I have this new experience with self-marriage this last few months because I have this group coaching program Turned-On Living. We’re together for a whole year. 

Every month has a theme. November was the soul commitment month. We chose to call it soul commitment because most of the women in the group were not that comfortable with the term “self-marriage” or it didn’t resonate for them. In the media, this idea of soul commitment was circulating and that resonated for them more. Basically it was the same thing. 

We constructed ceremony and rituals. They had music that they chose to pussywalk down the aisle. It was part of this three-day retreat that we did, as the final event culminating the weekend and the year. And my God, it was really beautiful to be at a group soul-commitment ceremony. 

Wow, that takes it to a whole other level because when you have a group of people committing, a group of women, but I think it could equally men could do this.

Committing to themselves and reading their vows out loud to each other and then dancing to songs they had chosen to step into those vows. It was one of the top ten experiences of my life really. It wasn’t my soul commitment. It was theirs. And I guess that’s what I mean about being a mother. I’m like the mother of this soul commitment ceremony for five women.That’s awesome.

PUSSYWALKING AND SENSUALITY COACHING FOR WOMEN

Now Sasha, you’ve just mentioned pussywalking. So if we can go on to so you’re you are a sensuality coach, aren’t you for women? Who are both single and partnered or married? Can you just tell me a little bit more about that sort of the the type of women that you work with what sort of work you’re doing with them?

I do love calling myself a sensuality coach in addition to a life coach or executive coach, because I have such an interest in the body. I feel that connecting with our bodies is such an important part of knowing who we are and feeling good. Feeling good is really a big part of my philosophy.

Life is not easy. There will be challenges but it’s really important to fuel ourselves with pleasure, and believe that we’re worthy of pleasure. And there can be sensuality coaching for women who are totally single. 

I think this is something that’s quite unique about me is that I have been associated with single women for so much of my career, and I’m very interested in sex and sensuality, how to amp up that part of our lives, whether we’re dating or whether we’re alone.

I like to talk about sexual energy and body connection to really empower us to know that we can be in connection with our sexual energy no matter what is going on in our lives, and that can be used for the good of our own expression being just how we feel everyday life walking down the street. 

PUSSYWALKING AND THE CENTERING OF WOMEN (WHILE INCLUDING MEN)

So pussywalking is a methodology that I created. That is, you know, it’s for any kind of person and in fact, I just taught one pussywalking workshop that included a man. So let’s say, single women, married women, partnered women. dating women, married men, single men, everybody could learn to pussywalk.

The focus is on female anatomy. Like all of my work, I center women, because we are decentered in general and so many aspects of life. 

So pussywalking came from my study of tango and my travels in South America and my immersion in the study of female sexuality and sensuality for empowerment. So it brings forward this knowledge that the clitoris is not just this little button on the outside like we were taught.

isn’t it the size of a medium, I know that you guys call them, eggplants? We call them aubergines over here.

Right, so inside our bodies, that clitoris is this whole structure that encircles the vaginal canal. Which could be seen as a vegetable. [Laughter.] And people use that analogy. 

All of it is nerve endings that can be activated. So pussywalking is a process of awakening the energy that is inside our bodies through those nerve endings. So it’s becoming more commonly known that women have in the clitoral glans, which is that little button, more nerve endings for pleasure than any other organ male or female, and that doesn’t include all the nerve endings that are inside. So this is just a tremendously sensitive organ. 

Basically pussywalking is an invitation to wake up that pussyenergy, which I teach through breathing and visualization of what actually is inside your body. And then using that awareness and energy as a focal point when a woman walks. 

I’ve been teaching pussywalking now for 10 years, which is pretty amazing. And I’ve been doing it on the down low a lot of that time because I was like, Oh my God. How was I going to talk about pussywlking? 

I had discovered this secret superpower of being a woman because I did a lot of sexual exploration. When I lived in San Francisco I was a part of a lot of workshops doing very outside-the-box stuff that activated put the energy or even taught me to say the word “pussy” because I definitely didn’t grow up saying word “pussy” at all. I had a lot of resistance to that.

I found through the cultivation out of that energy that I got this real boost that put me in the present moment, gave me a lot of radiant energy and gave me a lot of confidence. I used it for interviews that I went on. And there was one particular day when I was just shining with my pussy energy at this insurance company where they wanted me for corporate coaching. I was totally inexperienced at the time, but I nailed it. Like really well. It worked really, really well.

On the way out. I was in the elevator, and this guy said to me, “You look like you’re enjoying your life. And whatever you’re doing, keep doing it.” 

And because now that I’ve been teaching pussywalking to women, over the years, I have evidence of other women hearing similar.

The same thing to them, “Whatever you’re doing, it’s working.”

We actually have this “Dancing in the Woods” part of the Turned-On Living retreat last month. 

A guy walked by with his dog, and when he saw us dancing in the woods, he said, “Whatever you’re doing, it’s working.”  So there’s something about connecting with this pussy energy which puts people in a good place.

The other thing I might add is that as along with the empowerment side of things, it can also help with your posture, can’t it? So how did you how did you actually discover that? Was that something that you you were walking along and it just came to you that that was what you were doing? I mean, because pussywalking is like a form of meditation. Almost, isn’t it? Because it because you’re you’re concentrating your energy within a part of your body as you walk. 

Well, the truth is that I was living in the San Francisco Bay Area, in Oakland. I was practicing orgasmic meditation. And so I was doing a sexual spiritual practice, which is all about stroking very lightly the clitoris for 15 minutes and in a very structured container, a partner practice, as someone else was doing it. So this is like a whole other story and it is a complicated story because I learned it at a place that now I think would very clearly be called a sex cult. 

So pussywalking is a sort of extraction of the gems and wisdom that I got from going into these very edgy places that I wouldn’t send people to. That’s the tough thing about a lot of this sexual empowerment stuff. Many of the places… I’m a student of Tantra, I’m a student of Taoist sexuality, and I am very deep in all of this stuff. 

As a coach, I’m kind of a conduit of that information, delivering it in a safe, ethical way. A problem in this world is that a lot of those places are run by people who manipulate and take advantage of power because sexual energy is so powerful and people are very ripe for exploitation. It just happens that way. And it’s almost universal, how many stories there are of abuse that happen within places that teach sexuality. Very unfortunate.

So, yeah, this is a tricky part of the story, and I’m still figuring out how to tell it because the truth is that my pussy was very awakened because of the wonderful work that I got to do practicing orgasmic meditation at a place that had significant dark side. 

So the story… it was in my own life when I was going to this job interview and you know, I was like, wow, my pussy is on autopilot. Like I had gotten so much good attention down there. The labia were like, friends with each other. I was like, I’m walking and I feel like I’m having slow spiritual sex. That was the feeling really being in tune with my pussy. 

I’m a very sensitive type and energetic and like, I like sex when you’re hardly even moving. Let’s say like, your partner’s inside. You barely even moving and that can create this kind of delicious ultra-aliveness, and that was the feeling I had that was sort of the birth of pussywalking. So it’s not like oh my God, I’m having an orgasm. It’s not like that. You know, it’s sort of deliciousness that feels very alive and awake and pleasurable.

MEN AND PUSSYWALKING, OR MALE PUSSYWALKING AND MALE PUSSYENERGY

Sasha, you mentioned that men can do this as well.

Yeah, I know. It’s very mind-boggling to think about.

I love it. 

So, when I was in Bali in September and October, I taught a pussywalking workshop, and I hired a videographer. I’m editing those videos now. And as part of that small group of people in the workshop we had a man and so it’s going to be really fascinating when the video is ready to share because we have this male pioneer pussywalking. 

I’ve had very many men be interested in pussywalking, so I always thought that it would be cockwalking, but after a lot of thinking and study of this, I think what it is, is that it’s male pussywalking. As we’ve learned from books, a lot of people learn from Come As You Are, that the female genitalia and the way that our (female) sexual organs are expressed are an internal manifestation. Men have their pussy energy on the outside.

There’s a similar feeling of aliveness and subtle energetic awakening that can happen for men. And it’s the same place in their bodies. It’s also in the pelvis and the central organizing wheel of the body. 

And so, you know, for men, I think it’s this fascinating doorway about feeling connected with their sexual energy, but not going toward hard-on. Like this is something totally different, which, you know, many doors are opened in Tantra and Tao is sexuality about cultivating orgasm without ejaculation. Male pussywalking would be yet another cultivation of this aliveness and breathing down there and circulating that energy throughout the body. But without a goal. That’s very important for women. There’s also no goal other than just the experience itself.

It was absolutely unbelievable to have this man in the workshop because he said what you said he said. He’d read many books about posture, and that pussywalking was the simplest and most efficient way to improve his posture. He also felt all of these other benefits from pussywalking of slowing down and he was there with his wife. He felt it was something he could use to get out of work mode, being an engineer, and transition into more presence, being with other people or being with his wife, and also just being like a sensitive, strong male with a sexual energy but not in an aggressive way. 

I think that’s why the male pussywalking is a better thing to talk about than cockwalking. Because pussyenergy is not weak. Definitely not. But it’s also not going to overpower anyone. It’s more about autonomous power. 

Yes, yes. Because what I’ve sort of gleaned from from your work and from everything that you do, and that’s just going back to that sort of thing of dominance and also women feeling ashamed of their sexuality. I mean, that’s an inherent thing that we have historically felt. 

What I have felt from your work is that you’ve taken that very thing that we have been taught to be ashamed of, and turned it into the thing that gives you empowerment and freedom.

Thank you for seeing that.

ABOUT MY MEMOIR-IN-PROGRESS WET

So on that note, moving on from pussies to Wet. Can you tell us about your memoir, and I know that this is a story of healing through sensuality, isn’t it? 

I have been working on this book for at least 11 years now. And it took me four years to really understand what it was about. 

So on the surface level, this is a memoir about my decision to leave Silicon Valley and follow a bodily impulse to go to Brazil, which then led to a whole big long wander in South America with a ton of sexual and sensual experiences. I felt called to go to South America because I very much wanted to get away from screens and Silicon Valley. 

I wanted to be in my body and there was something about I just wanted to be in a sexy place. In the beginning, it was just like, you know, Dating isn’t working and I just need to feel alive and that was the first call. So basically, the story is about all of the different things that happens when first I was looking for happiness, let’s say through men, and a lot of different sexual experiences that weren’t turning into what I ultimately wanted. With boundaries being crossed and repeating patterns and you know, ultimately feeling stuck like unlovable and and kind of patterns that I had already been dealing with. 

And then the book or my story goes to Colombia where I discovered tango. Tango becomes this kind of training ground of learning how to find alignment and balance and true self-respect through being in my center and using the metaphor of dance as a way of how to have a healthy relationship with myself and with another person. 

So what’s going on in the background of all of this is healing the impacts of childhood sexual abuse and that was the thing that I didn’t want to look at and I was four years into the book where I started I was working with someone on a coaching about story using the hero’s journey structure from Joseph Campbell. That’s when I finally realized it. In the Hero’s Journey, you have to hit certain points like, Here’s where the character dies. Here’s where the character dies again, like there’s the ultimate lowest moment in the story. Every movie somehow follows this formula. 

I realized that like all the low moments were emotionally related to the impact of that early trauma that I never wanted to look at. So tango became a way of healing all those sensual experiences were a way of healing. I have such a big respect in a way for sex and for sensuality, learning through things through our bodies. Because we live in bodies.

A lot of people find healing and yoga. A lot of people have stories about healing from abuse through yoga. My way was through all this sex and tango. So the book is all about that.

And about all the things we’ve been talking about, about being a woman whose life did not conform to the norms, and making peace with that and walking tall instead of shrunken.

So there’s a lot with pussywalking that is about expansion. Not being ashamed, not hiding breasts, all of that stuff. Wet is really the story of that for me, because even though I was the Quirkyalone author, and people saw me as an empowering role model, I had a lot of shame that I was working through.

Shame is in the body. It’s Body Keeps the Score-stuff, you know that we internalize trauma and it makes us smaller and it has to be worked on through the body. You can’t just talk about it. You actually have to get in there and feel it and for some of us, like change how we are inside our bodies.

FINDING ANSWERS THROUGH OUR BODIES

And you have you work with people who say that, don’t you?

Yeah, I mean, I, as a coach, I always have to find a line between what is therapy and what is coaching.

But I come in as the piece of working with your body and connecting with your body. And finding, feeling and answers through what your body is telling you. 

People are different. People learn in different ways. For me and the people who are attracted to me as clients, we’re very kinesthetic people. 

For me, a lesson gets anchored in the body. I feel something differently. I feel it in tango. It’s all about like finding a posture that will allow for the energy to flow from one person to the other. And if one person is stooping, or falling over, or not respecting themselves, the energy gets cut. 

For example, finding that posture of alignment and pride that allows the energy to flow. For me that was an anchoring in my body of like, oh, this is what it’s like to be in a relationship and not lose myself. This is what it’s like to be in a relationship and hold my ground. This isn’t I was like to be in a relationship and not people-please in a very big way and lose myself so. That feeling of it physically, in a different way of holding my body is very effective and the people who are attracted to me want to do that. They also feel that way.

CULTIVATING SEXUAL ENERGY WHEN YOU ARE SINGLE 

Wonderful. So such as something that something else that I did want to ask you is as single women, how do we cultivate our sexuality? If we don’t have a partner? Like what would what would your advice be to single women? 

Okay, so I think that the first advice is just to ask this question of yourself, How do I as a single woman cultivate my sexuality? 

Because already this is opening the door and saying that this is possible. 

Because I think for a lot of people, the longer that goes by when you don’t have sex, it’s not flowing in that way. It’s very easy to think, Ooh, that’s just not for me, or I have to be in a relationship in order to explore my sexuality. This is a very strong idea that most people have: they think exploring your sexuality happens within a relationship.

I would say this is pretty different for me. I have always had a very strong feeling that I’m exploring my sexuality, no matter what. So I think already taking that stand for yourself is pretty big and opens a lot of doors to workshops. You could read books, things you can watch on Netflix, so already having it as important is a big step. Then I think it depends on where you are in your journey in terms of what’s next for you.

We have solo sex so you know already there it’s sort of opening the idea that like you can have sex with yourself. And that can also be a journey. This is something I’m personally very interested. First of all, a lot of women have problems with self-pleasure or masturbation because of a number of things. 

They might have come up in religious families where there could be a feeling that it’s wrong to do. 

Or it’s just not inspiring. It’s boring. It’s rote. It’s not unusual that someone could find it boring after a while, if you’re just by yourself.

But the cultivation of our sensuality is not just about getting to orgasm. And it is really something to give yourself to explore for example, a night in that is very sensual.

I have an exercise called the Visiting Dignitary which is basically playing this game with yourself and saying that a queen is coming to visit. You’re going to pick out something to satisfy everything of her senses. So something visual, something sound, something taste, something, I don’t know all the senses, plus something conceptual. Basically, it gets you to create a beautiful atmosphere. 

And then the trick is, Oh, the Queen canceled her visit. So the visiting dignitary is you. So you’ve created this lovely, sensual atmosphere for yourself. 

And then step two of this could be seducing yourself in the mirror. It could be, being in a self pleasure session that is more sensual with music. For example, Sensual Tantra Beats is a new good one that I discovered on Spotify.

I have a list of Sensual Resources. So if I’m thinking about putting it out there if people want it then then maybe this would help with this question. 

Yeah. 

(You can request the list here.)

What I’m giving you is a night in to dedicate to yourself and your sensuality and your sexuality. 

And you know, beyond that there can be the exploration of different sex toys. Different kinds of orgasms. Different kinds of sexual experiences you can have with yourself. I fully understand from my life experience that probably most people don’t only want to have solo sex and you probably do want to have sex with others. 

And yet, you will have better sex if you have solo sex with yourself, you will get to know yourself and you may have amazing experiences. So I wouldn’t say this is the only way but it’s like, I think really firmly putting the flag in the ground was like yeah, I’m single and I don’t have a partner and I’m still sexual. I can have solo sex. And there’s a bunch of other things I can do. I can go to workshops, I can go on a sexy vacation. 

I think it’s really important to do that because the sexual instinct dries up and it goes away and it just becomes distant. And so I mean, on the one hand is a drag to have to kind of consciously cultivate this on your own. I guess the the saving grace is a lot of couples struggle with this as well and there are a lot of people are in sexless marriages. So it’s kind of the same challenge that people in long-term relationships face about how to keep it fresh and how to keep it alive. 

It’s just not talked about as much though, is it?

No, we talk about couples drying up but gee, what happens when you’re on your own?

 Exactly. It’s funny you saying about the the I read an article the other day, and it was so interesting. The author was interviewing women between 20 and 70. So they were all in their own decades. I think it was the lady in in her 40s. She described how she taken herself away for a night in a hotel. She taken all of her sex toys with her. She got dressed up and went downstairs for a meal. She said that in the dining room there very much an opportunity arose. There was a guy in the room that she said, you know, she could have ended up having sex with him, but she chose her original plan which was to go back up, have a bath, and have her evening to herself. I was so inspired by that because you don’t read these things. You don’t see these things enough. And it’s and I think that’s really important to put across to single women. 

And another point that I would make is about learning about yourself and about what you like.

Surely that can then be taken into a relationship as maybe a form of confidence. You know, we are very people0pleasing. I know that a lot of women, most of them have probably experienced a sexual situation where it’s li okay, that’s it’s not really for me, so to be able to say to a partner, I like this. I don’t like that.  I think that that could really help somebody to explore themselves. 

Yeah. 100%

I mean, I think that the quality of connection that we can have with another person is very related to the quality of knowledge that we have of our own bodies and what knowing more about what we enjoy. I think that’s the most important thing. I can fall into this trap myself too. There can be a lot of tons of shame around sex, obviously, like especially the English culture, the American culture. These are cultures with so much repression and shaming around sex. And so even the idea of like when I say sex is important for you, whether you’re single or a couple or whatever, and that it’s a good thing to want to learn about sex. It doesn’t mean that there’s a deficiency. It means that you have a learning and growth mindset.

We have a sexuality and sensuality month in Turned-On Living. 

I was quite conscious about wanting us to adopt that as our mindset because otherwise, there can just be this feeling of defensiveness, or “No I’m okay,” or “Nothing wrong with my sexuality,” or you know, and really feeling inadequate. Either I’ve had too many partners. I haven’t had enough partners. There’s just so many ways to feel bad and broken. 

And the reality is that in some way, this is an exciting time because I would say in the arena of sexuality, there are more and more books, more sex toys, more resources than there ever had been before. 

If anyone wants that list of sexuality and sensuality resources, email me and I’ll point you to it because I created this list for the Turned-On Living group, and wow, there’s a ton of things you can do for a whole yearlong program. 

You can look at OMGYes which is videos of women who show how they touch themselves to climax and they talk about it so it’s very interesting, evidence-based stuff about how women achieve climax.

This is, you know, very explicit, and very much to learn from other women about what helps them and the individuality of each person.

And then you have something like the Erotic Blueprints which was created by this woman Jaiya, which is all these sort of different types that a person can be sexually like you could be an energetic, could be a sensual. You could be a sexual, which is what we normally think of as sex. Or kinky. 

Sex, Love & Goop is a great series. That leads people through all these different problems and coaching that they get around their body and sexuality. I don’t that sort has been a time when there’s been more about sexuality and sensuality that’s available to us.

It’s still it’s quite a rare interest. I’m realizing now I’m a sex geek, like I’ve always been into this.

This is kind of my thing.

But more and more people are getting are exploring that way. And I mean, I would say that’s a good thing about today. 

Just actually you just mentioned though I’m aware of the time.

WHAT IS TURNED-ON LIVING? AND WHAT I DO WITH MY CLIENTS

Because we were chatting beforehand as well, wasn’t it? Um, Sasha, you just mentioned about turned-on living. And so you’re a life and executive coach for women. 40-plus, aren’t you, helping with turned-on lives, careers and businesses? Can you just give me that in a nutshell what you’re what you’re doing.

So I talked about Turned-On Living as a way of talking about people living authentically and in ways that feel true to them and exciting. Turned-On Living is also this group program that I started last year and I’ll run the second year of soon. And it’s really a philosophy I would say a body connection and tuning into your body as a way of knowing your true feelings, emotions, desires.

I created this curriculum that goes for 12 months with different topics from self compassion, to boldness to prioritizing pleasure, sexuality and sensuality, anti-people-pleasing is a big one. 

So I find that a lot of my clients have this tendency of being more nice than they want to be. And that has a way of draining turn on or lifeforce energy when you’re doing things you don’t really want to do.

My work is about empowerment, and there’s this body connection. Some of my clients are executives and very high level and then I have clients who are not that and are regular people.

WORKING WITH SENSUALITY AND SEXUALITY, AT EVERY AGE

But and I really I love working with people who have this openness to their body connection and if they want to talk about sensuality, sexuality, yes. I mean, it’s, it’s funny. It’s just one of my greatest joys in life is helping someone to have better sex lives.

I love it. I love turning women on and especially single women to the possibility of connecting with their own sexuality and sexual energy because otherwise is this feeling that we’re left to die on the vine. Especially as we get older, and it’s like, Do you get to still feel alive? 

Yes, you do. Like, of course, and there are women who specifically focused on sex for older people, and they’re doing this work too. (See Joan Price.) Like you said before, somewhere in our conversation, we can just get better we can know ourselves more we can have different sex, better sex. We can feel more.

I see sex as an infinite journey, that there’s always more to uncover and experience. 

There is absolutely and especially with different partners as well. Everybody is different. So Sasha, thank you so much. I have enjoyed this conversation. So, so much, I really have.

HOW TO STAY IN TOUCH

Could you just just let us know, where can people find you and also, if they wanted you to email the list as well?

Go to my website, sashacagen.com, go to the newsletter page and sign up there because that’s the best way to be in touch also can follow me on Instagram but the newsletter is where I really share with people.

If you want that list, then just send me an email. Once you’re on the newsletter list, we’ll be in contact. 

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Self-Compassion for Quirkyalones, or, Learning to develop your “oh honey” self-compassionate voice

Do you worry that there might be something wrong with you because you are still single?

Then, watch the above class, Self-Compassion for Quirkyalones! Let me know how it goes for you when you do the journaling exercise we do together to develop your self-compassionate voice, and what you learn from the others who attended live, and who shared so bravely and freely.

Here’s a full disclosure. I asked ChatGPT to list the top ten self-critical thoughts of single people. I wrote, “What are the actual self-critical thoughts that single people say to themselves? In quotation marks, inside someone’s head.” The AI machine spit out results, and I edited them to make them more real based on what I have heard from the people I have coached and talked with over the last 20 years, since publishing my first book Quirkyalone: A Manifesto for Uncompromising Romantics.

Note: I have mixed feelings about ChatGPT, and negative feelings about AI, so I am being transparent with you in service of keeping the human vibe going in my newsletter and blog. The robots are coming!

Here’s the edited list:

  • “I’m still single. What’s wrong with me?”
  • “Everyone else seems to be in a relationship. So, again, what’s wrong with me? Am I unlovable?”
  • “Maybe I’m too picky. Maybe I should settle for someone to avoid being alone.”
  • “I must be undesirable if I can’t seem to find a partner.”
  • “If I were more attractive/confident/successful/not messy/some non-specific thing that no one could ever really say, maybe I’d have better luck finding a partner.”
  • “I always mess things up in relationships. Maybe I’m just not cut out for love in this lifetime.”
  • “I’m falling behind in life because I’m not in a relationship like everyone else.”
  • “What if I end up alone forever? Will I regret my choices?”
  • “Maybe I need to change myself to fit what others want in a partner.”
  • “Will I ever find someone who truly wants to commit to me? Why would they want to commit to me? I have so many problems.”

Do any of these sound familiar?

The key to turning the self-critical voice around is first learning to recognize the thoughts as critical, rather than the “truth.” The second step is learning that another voice can take the mic.

Developing an “oh honey” self-compassionate voice can literally change your life. It has mine.

If you struggle with any of the above thoughts in your head, I implore you to watch the video above, an hourlong community free online class I taught to celebrate the 20th anniversary of the publication of my first book Quirkyalone! This was an extraordinary gathering with wonderful people, and the information shared can make an impact on anyone’s life. Let me know what you discover in the comments.

P.S. We spend a whole month on self-compassion in Turned-On Living, my yearlong group coaching adventure that goes for real transformation in a curated group of women. I’ve noticed that developing the “oh-honey” self-compassionate voice is the game-changing first step, and the foundation, for any meaningful change. If we don’t work on self-compassion first, we lose all our energy beating up on ourselves as soon as we start to go outside our comfort zones.

If you want to build the life-changing skill of being kind to yourself, you have to practice. It’s not so different from going to the gym, or learning tango or any other dance. You have to practice to see results. The best way to learn anything new is to do it in community with others who share the journey. That’s why I created Turned-On Living as a curated small group program.

We get started in June. The group is forming now. Check out the page and see if it’s calling you.

Bringing embodiment and self-love to the masses on the Dr. Phil show on self-marriage (!)

Being on the Dr. Phil show on self-marriage was a wild ride, to say the least

I said, “When I listen to you, I feel tense in my body,” to the conservative man they brought on to be my foil, I fell back on all my somatic coaching training because I was truly at a loss for what to say with all the nonsense coming out of his mouth about people marrying animals!

Sonya and Danni, the two other women who appeared on the show to share their stories are truly spectacular.

Together we helped to show that what at first seems like a weird idea really is not.

Be sure to sign up for my newsletter for the juicy stories that are yet to come about how this came to be.

If you are interested in marrying yourself with guidance and support, you can  join the next cohort of my group coaching program Turned-On Living, where you get to enter into the process with the support of other women on the self-love journey.

And… let me know what you thought about the show!

Would love to hear any and all reactions! With a caveat: no hate tolerated. Any nasty comments on this blog post will be deleted.

PS  August 16, 2023: The YouTube account that hosted the full episode got deleted. I’ll look for another recording. To get the full story, read this account published in November 7, 2023, “The True Story of My (Ill-Advised?) Decision to Appear on the Dr. Phil Show.”

 

With Sonya and Danni, the other two (fabulous) women guests who married themselves, on the Dr. Phil show. Thanks to assistant producer Kalley for the photo. I helped Kalley and her sister Camryn get engaged to themselves after the show!

Getting Real on “Spinsterhood Reimagined with Lucy Meggeson” (New Podcast Interview)

Lucy Meggeson who lives across the pond in the UK, who is great and hilarious, and who is definitely my kind of woman (I bet we could be BFFs if we lived in the same city), interviewed me for her new podcast Spinsterhood Reimagined.

Here’s the description: “Are you single, childfree, and tired of the stigma attached to your ‘spinster’ status? Are you actually having an awesome time, loving your life because of the freedoms afforded to you as a result of being alone and not having kids? Or are you not quite there yet? Either way, this is for you.”

Lucy’s mission is to help other women who happen to be single and childfree know their own value, and that their lives are just as meaningful as anyone else’s. Knowing that working with single women has been a focus of my coaching practice, she asked me all kinds of juicy questions. Because she made me feel so comfortable, I told her the truth, the whole truth! I so suggest that you give this one a listen!

Lucy asked about:

  • The best part of being single, even when it’s not your first choice
  • How I finally found peace in not becoming a mother, and appreciate my life on its own terms, after years of struggle with that topic
  • My own relationship history: quirkyalone and quirkytogether. I am known for celebrating singledom but I’ve actually always been pretty relationship-oriented! In this episode we talk about women who want to be quirkyalone, women who have always been in relationship and haven’t paid as much attention to their own needs and desires, and how I help them get clear about what they really want in relationships and life, and live fully.
  • How I used to be embarrassed to call myself a life coach, but not I’m embarrassed by it anymore now that coaching has grown and gotten more respect, and more people are wising up to the value of hiring a coach
  • How I draw on tango and physical mindfulness practices like pussywalking to help my clients step into their power at work and in relationships, and become the women they want to be
  • The power of listening to your body (and developing your sensuality) to make better decisions and change your life

We had so much fun recording this episode, and we hope you enjoy it! Let us know what you think in the comments, and be sure to leave Lucy’s podcast a review if you like it.

Here’s a funny little promo Lucy made for the episode. Lucy used to be an audio engineer at the BBC. Can you tell?

Dating Advice From My Spirit Animal Jonathan Van Ness

Life is feeling a bit overwhelming lately, and so in today’s newsletter, I decided to go light with this dollop of joy and enlightenment from my spirit animal Jonathan Van Ness, author of Love That Story, and star of Queer Eye and host of Getting Curious.

There are a lot of reasons to love Jonathan, but I think one thing I admire most is his unabashed enthusiasm. He often sounds like a nine-year-old girl getting super excited about something he truly believes in, and that is such an attractive quality in an adult.

Drew Barrymore asked JVN (as he is known), “What is your advice for people who are actively dating?”

And by the way, this is excellent advice for life, and work, as well as dating.

JVN: “Even if you are looking to be in relationship with someone, we always are going to come back to our relationships with ourselves.

In yoga this one time we learned, we all learned that we all have this invisible magnet inside of us that is positively or negatively charged, you know. I think when you are working on yourself, it’s going to charge that magnet in such a way that the person you are meant to be with is going to vibe towards you anyway, so you really can’t lose by investing in yourself and your relationship with yourself anyway.”

Drew: “This is why I asked you this question!”

A Heart That Loves Itself Cannot Be Broken. Is This True?

a self-love poster spotted on Providence’s not-so-mean streets

I spotted this philosophical poster on my way across the street to walk underneath the changing trees of fall.

“A heart that loves itself cannot broken.”

First let me say that I love these mysterious people who are stapling self-love posters to telephone poles. Their intent to spread the message of self-compassion could not be more admirable. Their tactile work is so much more satisfying and human to take in than another inspirational quote on Instagram.

My heart swelled reading their message. But my critical mind could not stop there.

“But is this true?” I stopped to ask myself, before crossing the street to walk through the park. “Is it really true that a heart that loves itself cannot be broken?”

the first blush of fall on that walk

My heart got broken this year in a way that it had not been broken in years. There were nights when I woke up at 4 am and felt like a meteor had landed in my heart, leaving a charred crater in its wake. The despair of that break-up left my heart jagged and in pieces.

Did that mean that I don’t love myself? Or did that mean I was allowing myself to feel?

I thought about that lovely poster on my walk through the trees.

Here’s how I would amend the text if I were to make it feel true to me.

“A heart that loves itself cannot be permanently broken.”

“A heart that loves itself heals more quickly after heartbreak.”

“A heart that loves itself will not lose itself in grief for years.”

“A heart that loves itself will grow more resilient to love again.”

When I was going through the worst of this heartbreak, someone told me it was a good sign that my heart hurt so deeply. Being more heartbroken than ever, he said, meant I had opened up to love, and the hurt would only lead my heart to grow back stronger. I took solace in the idea that heartbreak could only grow my capacity to love.

Here is what I know for sure by now: Heartbreak is unavoidable. Loss is the flaw in love. Many of our attempts at romantic relationships do not work out over the long-term. Even superficial online dating attempts can break your heart, slowly over time, little by little, cut by cut. Horrible people will be elected as our leaders. People will disappoint us. Our friends and lovers and family will pass away.

There is always going to be heartbreak and disappointment.

The best we can hope for is that our hearts break and then grow back stronger. Self-love comes when we stop blaming ourselves. The key to healing your heart is taking out the thorn of self-blame.

Healing is a shift in perspective. A shift of knowing that you are lovable and life can be good even after devastation. Cue the song, “I Will Survive.” Seriously, if you are going through a heartbreak right now, play that song on YouTube and dance to it. We need to feel the feelings and let them move through us, through journaling, talking with a trusted friend, coach or therapist, dancing, walking, or whatever works best for you to alchemize the pain.

It’s not inevitable that a heart grows back stronger. A heart can also break and not stitch back together. A heart can grow bitter, jaded, shriveled, and resigned, which happens all the time.

Many, many people give up on love and their dreams all the time. It’s a miracle to keep going and to be at peace with your life as it is right now.

It takes a strong heart to keep on beating. A heart that loves itself.

P.S. In a little over two weeks, on Thursday November 4, at 8 pm ET (NYC time), I am going to interview my dear friend Carolyn Arnold about her new memoir Fifty First Dates after Fifty. This is a free online event to celebrate the launch of Carolyn’s book. We would love for you to join us.

Carolyn, an inveterate social scientist, and definitely a quirky, independent woman, devised an unusual dating plan to go on fifty first dates to find the right partner for her. I’ll be asking her about how she stitched her heart back together after disappointments and rejections.

Once you have been slammed a number of times in dating, how can you stay positive and keep going? You can read this interview I did with Carolyn way back in 2012 to get a taste for what we will be talking about.

If you have been considering working with me as your life coach this free event is a nice low-pressure chance to get to know me a little better and see me in action interviewing Carolyn. If you are over 40, 50, 60, or 70 and battle voices in your head thinking it’s too late, you should definitely come. You can register here.

What Netflix’s Love on the Spectrum Has to Teach All of Us About Dating

If you are looking for something to watch, I suggest Love on the Spectrum, an Australian docu-series on Netflix about autistic people on their dating journeys.

It’s light, entertaining, and uplifting. Plus, the people they are following have a lot to teach all of us, including neurotypical people, about how to be emotionally brave in dating.

Love on the Spectrum is the best dating show because the people are so incredibly real. They say things like this, “I feel very warm, appreciated, and comfortable with you. How would you like to go out with me on a third date?” I loved it when one of them said he would never want to be on The Bachelor because he wouldn’t get to be himself.

Dating is tough enough for everyone, but it is has got to be tougher for autistic people who face stigma and tend to find social interactions challenging. What I love about the people on the show is their honesty. No pretending, no facade. What you see is what you get.

When it comes to love, their sincerity is so refreshing. They get hurt and disappointed, but they don’t get jaded and they don’t give up. One of the most important qualities to cultivate when you are dating is resilience. They also have parents who really support their self-love.

Lovely Michael is not afraid to say, “I’m on a quest to find true love.” How many of us are willing to say that out loud?

Another great line comes from 22-year-old Teo, who said, “I get so nervous about… what if I die alone?” Who says that on a date?

They bring gifts on first dates. They take it slow. They ask permission to hug or hold hands. Their courtships are so quaint and lovely compared to the hot mess of the dating-app world.

The people on the show get advice from Jodi Rodgers, relationship specialist for autistic people, who teaches them how to ask questions and listen to the answers.

Since the dating apps have come to dominate the ways we meet, almost everyone today needs a rudimentary course on how to date today because phone-based apps like Tinder and Hinge have shaped many people’s behaviors to be downright rude and bizarre.

I suspect the producers are heavily coaching them to say how they really feel on their dates, or they are just the most authentic people ever. I have never seen modern-day people be more open confessing their feelings. “I’m into you–how do you feel about me?”

Someone has to be brave enough to ask that question first. Telling someone else how you feel on a date equals MAJOR LIFE SKILL.

The people on the show are young, in their twenties and early thirties. I would like to see the show follow older people on the spectrum in their dating journeys too and to hear about how their relationships have gone.

The bottom-line message from the show is: Be yourself. Be brave.

Always good advice in dating and life.

++

I have one spot open at the moment in my coaching practice. If you have been curious about working with me and waiting to reach out, now may be the time. You can tell me more about what you want to explore or work on through coaching here.

YDB

Hey there, happy Sunday!

Today I wanted to share this gem with you.

YDB.

A friend told me about YDB. I am not sure of the origin of this wisdom, but it’s too good to not share.

This is for all of you who are struggling with an ex, a break-up, an RO (romantic obsession).


I know how hard it can be to get over people especially when you have opened your heart after it’s been closed for a while–and allowed yourself to believe in love again.

It didn’t work out. And your heart hurts. You can’t believe how long you are thinking about this person and what you once shared.

Here’s what you do. You tap into the power of YDB.

What does YDB mean?

You Dumb Bastard?

Yucky Discolored Box Syndrome? (Yes, this exists on the Internet. It has something to do with Adobe.)

No.

It means YOU DESERVE BETTER!

So go ahead and write the acronym YDB before his or her name in your phone contacts list, if she or he is still in there. Or emblazon YDB before their name in your mind. YDB Mark. YDB Carlos. YDB Francesca. Change their name to YDB-their name for as long as you need to.

Maybe it feels like a leap to believe that there is someone out there for you who will be a better match for you. Well, in the meantime, you also deserve better than torturing yourself with thoughts about someone who doesn’t want to be with you anyway.

Whenever we are trying to change our experience, we are working on changing our thoughts. That process typically doesn’t happen overnight. Choosing new thoughts on purpose is a practice. It’s like going to the gym and lifting weights. The strength to choose new thoughts comes because you are consistently choosing differently.

So whenever that person comes to mind, you repeat YDB.

By brute force we start to believe that new thought.

Put it in your phone or in your journal or on a sticky note on your refrigerator.

YDB.

Single in the Pandemic

The humorist Fran Leibowitz (star of Netflix’s docu-series “Pretend It’s a City”) talked to NPR’s Terry Gross about living alone in New York City during Covid.

Leibowitz said, “Well, it still seems to me to be by far the best choice. I cannot understand how people who do not live alone have stood this last 10 months, because the only upside of having to stay in my apartment is at least there was no one else there. I would find that unbearable, I mean, truly unbearable.”

Ha! When I heard this line on the radio, I glanced around my own apartment to ask myself whether I was happy that there was no one else there. I mean, sure, I love my solitude and all my weird secret single behaviors, with no TV blaring news programs or sports I don’t care about, but I can’t say that I genuinely agreed with Leibowitz that living alone during Covid is the best option—for me. I am not quite the badass Fran L. is, or rather, I’m a different breed of badass.

We all experience living alone and being single differently. Even if we can be OK with being single–or actively enjoy it–living Covid single has been something else. Since I’ve been in transition from Buenos Aires back to the U.S., I’ve done a little bit of everything over the last year: living alone, living with family, in a relationship, and single. I have to say, the transitions were the hardest. Living alone after spending weekends with a partner or living family most of the time was tough. Solitude is a good thing—and there can be too much of a good thing. I missed having people to talk to without setting up a Zoom or dialing the phone.

I was glad to see this news story from the New York Times: A Pandemic is Hard Enough, For Some Being Single Has Made It Harder. The concerns of people who live alone have often been ignored by governments in coronavirus guidelines that unilaterally discourage household mixing—what about all those households of one? For many of us who are single and living alone, the need for human contact can push us to the limit. Some of my single coaching clients have talked about not feeling human, just because they are working on Zoom or email, missing all the serendipitous, everyday fleeting encounters we’d normally have, at the dry cleaners or the office.

Not everyone has access to the New York Times so I will give you a few key nuggets:

“Some who said they were content with being single before the pandemic have nonetheless struggled with what they’re missing in emotional support and even routine physical touch.”

“…while people missed sex, there was more severe pining for nonsexual forms of touch: the day-to-day contact, couch cuddling and hugs — even high-fives — that have been severed off in an age of social distancing.”

“For some, losing nearly a year of searching for a partner is time people didn’t think they could spare…” “That’s especially an issue for those feeling a biological rush to have children.”

This is an especially good Twitter thread to read. A clinical oncology consultant in the UK started a conversation about the dreadfulness of being single during Covid.

All this time alone has its silver linings. Look at all that time you have to get in shape/learn a new language/get clear about what you really want in a relationship and your life. That’s all true, and I’m all for using our time intentionally, living consciously and deliberately.

And we need to be real about the challenges we are facing. Otherwise we stuff down the emotion in our bodies, and it manifests as pain, illness, stiffness, and get this—fatigue! Is that why Covid has been so tiring?

What about you? How are you living Covid? If you are single, are you savoring the alone time or dying for the time when you can go out dancing or to the gym or to yoga class, or wherever it is that you see people? If you’re in a relationship, do you sometimes wish you were living alone? If you are single and living alone, do you wish you were cohabiting so you had someone to talk with? If you’re single with kids home, how is it going for you?

Let us know in the comments.

I want to remind you that I am a life coach who specializes in working with women and men who identify or aspire to the quirkyalone concept, so if you have quirkyalone tendencies and you are struggling with any of the above (or something else), there’s a good chance that I will “get” you.

Could you benefit from the structure and support of life coaching?

If you think life coaching with me might be something for you, go ahead and send a message here.

Tell me what you want to focus on achieving or exploring through coaching.

If I think there’s a good chance I can help, we’ll set up a time for a free phone consult to discover whether we are a good fit.

Self-marriage catches on in Latin America. Misconceptions cleared up here.

Last month was one of the more bizarre periods of my life. When I married myself five years ago it was an entirely private ritual that only two friends attended. Marrying myself had nothing to do with being single. Marrying myself was about a deep process of self-love and -acceptance. Really marrying myself was part of a healing process.

After TeleNoche aired an interview with me about self-marriage a month ago the Argentine (and Latin American) press got interested–as far away as Marie Claire Mexico.

I did three TV interviews, two radio, and two for the press, all in Spanish! Whoah!

Suddenly everyone knew me as “the first woman in Argentina who married herself.” People I interact with daily on my block (at the cafe, gym, kiosco, and health food store) congratulated me.

Weeks later my body pump teacher at the gym is still teasing me every time I slow down during the class. “Sasha, is marriage not treating you well?”

The latest surreal conversation on my block was with the Venelezuan at the local dietetica (health food shop) who came out from behind the counter when I was shopping to ask if was me. “Are you the woman who married herself?” I was there to buy almond milk and suddenly I was talking to him about what happens when women make vows to themselves.

If the people in my neighborhood are any indication, self-marriage had captured the attention of Argentina. Or Latin America. I didn’t even know it was possible anymore to achieve such media penetration now with so many different outlets. A woman in my weekly writing group told me she heard people talking about self-marriage everywhere from Twitter to Clarin to La Nación, Argentina’s leading conservative paper where a man wrote this little essay mocking self-marriage. He ended this with this typically Argentine poetic ending, “I point out that there is no love for oneself, above all, because there is no love for oneself without love for the other. and vice versa.”

Right. Exactly. That’s what I have been saying. We are in agreement buddy. My self-marriage was a private act. I never posted about marrying myself when I took that leap back in 2014 but I got a lot of benefit from marrying myself so when media wants to talk to me about it I oblige. My self-marriage was all about building my capacity to love myself–and others too. Then people get angry that women want to love themselves! “You’re such a narcissist.” “How sad you couldn’t find anyone to marry.” “Society is falling apart, etc.”

Maybe these people haven’t noticed that women have a tendency to give away so much of themselves in relationship (or in the pursuit of relationship) there is not enough left for themselves. When you love yourself you have more love to give. You’ll have better relationships! Why is making vows to love and care for yourself narcissistic? On the other hand, the Marie Claire Mexico got it just right in their writeup, pointing out that you can be in a relationship and marry yourself too.

How this “First Woman to Marry Herself in Argentina” madness started

This Latin American wave of self-marriage publicity started three weeks ago when Jason Mayne, a young reporter from TeleNoche was researching self-marriage because he was going to LA to do a story and wanted to do more. He discovered in a news story that I married myself here in 2014 in Buenos Aires’ Japanese Garden. He emailed me and two days later we taped an interview about self-marriage in the Japanese Garden, just where I had married myself with two friends in a very private, tiny ceremony five years before, witnessed by two close friends: one Colombian, one Estonian, both fellow tangueras.

I didn’t tell anyone on social media about my self-marriage when it happened. No one cared for five years. Where were all those self-wedding presents? Hahahahah evil laugh. After TeleNoche, all of a sudden all Argentine media wanted to talk to me.

In the last two weeks I have done three television interviews, two radio interviews, and one print interview (Infobae) for one of the biggest new sources. One Argentine friend emailed to say, “You’re busier than the president!” In fact, I  lost myself in all the TV interviews. Neglecting my self-care meant that I needed to come back to the vows of my self-marriage to put my my health ahead of my work! I found the whole experience to be both scary (what do these people in Argentina think of me now? I must admit I do think about what people think of me) and extremely confidence-building. I had no idea I could do television interviews in Spanish. When I listened to this fifteen-minute radio interview with a station in Mendoza, I was in shock. I sounded like a porteña (a Buenos Aires person)!

Self-marriage does not equal “sologamia.” Please stop using that horrible word!

All the while I have been continually clearing up misconceptions. The media loves using “sologamia” in headlines and asking me how I am living the word “sologamia.” I don’t even know what that word means, and I never used the word to describe self-marriage, but let’s make it clear. The word “sologamia” clearly creates an impression in people’s mind that marrying yourself means you are committing to be alone. That might be the case for some women or men who marry themselves, but that has never been the case for me or even one of the women I have talked to who have married themselves. Self-marriage is a ritual that involves making vows to yourself, and it’s usually a ritual of self-love and self-acceptance.

I am currently single and want to be in a relationship. But that doesn’t mean I would divorce myself. This self-marriage is forever.

Would you marry yourself? Pollo, the host of Con Amigos Asi, would!

So with all of that, I present you the transcript from this truly hilarious segment of “Con Amigos Asi” where the first woman who married herself in Argentina explained how and why it’s done.

This interview was truly like nothing you have seen on American (or probably European) TV.  It was like hanging out with a group of friends at an asado (BBQ). My friend Sharon said it was like an asado with great vibes.

I surprised the twentysomethings on the show because they assumed marrying myself meant I closed the door on marriage. No. There are no closed doors. These are two distinct things.

I explained that as I got older it becomes clear that the path of self-love is very important but it’s not recognized in society.

They were very open to listening as well as joking around.

We did some really hilarious spontaneous mini-coaching sessions on their contradictory feelings about relationships. “Sometimes I’m happy, Sometimes I cry. I’m confused Sasha.”

Also, one more thing: When I talked about this show with my Colombian friend (who also married herself and cares deeply that people get the deeper meaning of self-marriage) she worried people would get the wrong idea and think that marrying yourself is kind of like that joke on Seinfeld, when Jerry meets a woman played by Janeane Garafolo and says, “I found my soul mate, this woman is incredible, she is just like me!” That was a funny joke but no, that’s not what self-marriage is about! Self-marriage is about self-acceptance, not marrying your doppelganger.

Also facial treatments are great self-care but they are probably not the deepest expression of self-love. (During one of the spontaneous mini-coaching sessions on the show one of the women said she would express love for herself with facial treatments.)

But I will trust that you get that these are jokes.

Self-marriage is profound and funny, like the best things in life.

An asado (bbq) with really good vibes – watch it here with a transation

Note: We have an English translated transcript of this video below. For your best watching experience, you can click through to watch on YouTube and scroll down to read the transcript as you watch.

Sasha Cagen: The Woman who Married Herself, interview on “Con Amigos Asi” on the Argentine cable TV channel KZO

Pollo: I don’t have it clear.

Juan: What? What? Wait, wait.

Pollo: And now, the only woman who married herself… well, I do not know if she is the only one, but she is the only one in the program today. She married herself… she married herself!

Pablo:  And she is not unfaithful with herself. I cannot believe it!

Pollo:  She married herself and imagine how much less mess you have to go through. She has no problem living together with a partner, they do not fight over going to their parents´ houses.

Juan: No….

Pablo: Incredible!

Jani: For me, she was a visionary.

Pollo: This starts here and never ends!

Pablo: She separates from her husband and keeps everything!

Pollo Exactly, there is no contract to pronounce it…

Juan: If she doesn´t cook, nobody else will.

Yani: Phew! She should have been when the lawyer was here.

Pollo: Wait! What?

Juan: Wait and… Can I ask you a question?

Pollo: Yes, in fact you can ask her but I can help you.

Juan: Would you marry Pollo Alvarez?

Pollo: Yes, I would marry myself.

Juan: Yes?

Pablo: Wow!

Pollo: I consider myself a good candidate.

Pablo: Would you marry Pablito Giménez?

Pablo: Yes, bolúdo (Argentine Spanish word to call someone an asshole in a friendly way). Yes. If I don´t love myself, who else will?

Juan: I won´t marry marry Juan. No way.

Pablo: That is true.

Yani: We all know that. Luckily it´s crystal clear.

Juan: You believe in my a lot, eh!

[Laughs]

Pollo: I… Yes. The truth is that If I think about it, yes, yes, I would marry myself, yes.

Joshi: For me, the ideal partner.

Pollo: With whom?

Joshi: Me.

Pollo: With yourself?

Joshi: Yes (nodding her head)

Pollo: Well, now I speak with her. Let’s welcome the dearest Sasha Cagen! Welcome, please come forward. Sasha Cagen (pronounced in English)? In English is it Cagen?

Juan: Sasha…

Joshi: (pronouncing her surname correctly): Cagen!

Sasha: Hi, how are you?

Pollo: Welcome! Come in, please!

[A lot of back and forth about how to pronounce “Cagen” in English and Spanish.]

Pollo: Really, because obviously, surely, to do what you did, has to do with a process and with something that you believe in, but for outsiders, perhaps the most orthodox ones, you got our attention. So tell us, what is it all about?

Sasha: Well, yes, it’s usually not that someone wakes up one day and decides to marry herself or himself. Self-marriage is usually part of a period of introspection. I think it’s something people who are working on these things to love themselves enter into this process of self-marriage. It is something you can do for recognition in your life, as an adult. Because we do not have many rituals for adults. We have marriage and, I do not know what else, a birthday, but it is not something very…

Yani: Fatherhood. Motherhood, too.

Sasha: Yes, and well you can even marry yourself if you are already married. I am a life coach and I have helped women who are married to marry themselves. Because… especially women have a tendency to get lost in the relationship with others. Whether you are single or you are with someone, self-marriage can be a ritual to make a commitment to yourself. It is very personal and it is very creative because we do not have magazines that tell you what to do when you marry yourself. That’s why it is very free.

Pollo: Now I ask you, I understand what you are saying to me, that to marry yourself is creative and that it is part of the process but what is the difference between marrying oneself and not marrying oneself. Because in general I do not understand.

Joshu: The change?

Yani: The difference?

Pollo: What is the difference? Forgive my ignorance.

Yani: Single or married with yourself–isn’t that the same?

Sasha: It’s a process, a ritual …it´s something that you want….

Yani: Ah! It´s a ritual.

Sasha: I believe people have to be….

Joshu: Something symbolic maybe….

Sasha: People want something to do for that ritual of self-love. It’s symbolic and for me it was something that happened some months before my 40th birthday, because I felt a lot of pressure and unhappy because I had not found a man to marry. I was also doing therapy and thinking about how to love myself after working through many internal things. And it was weird, of course, it was strange.

That’s why for me, to marry myself here in Argentina was so much more free. I was far from my family, my normal friends … [Laughter] I have also my not-so-normal friends … open-minded friends I met in tango and they supported me. My Colombian friend, she got married to herself too. And she was present in my day. [Note: It should be said I have plenty of open-minded friends in California too!]

Pollo: Did she marry herself?

Sasha: Yes, she was present and….

Joshu: And did she know about this because of you?

Yani: No, no she married herself.

Joshu: Yes, yes, but did she get to know about it from you … I think this self-marriage is a beautiful idea, did she hear it for the first time from you?

Sasha: No. It was ten years ago, when I published this book [holding the Quirkyalone book in her hand]. I interviewed two women in California who married themselves. When I was 30, for me it was also like, why do you need to do this? I also was judgmental but I also felt interested in it. But it was also like … hmm … good for you, but it’s not for me. After time as I got older I realized that it is so very important to love yourself. To learn to love yourself really is a very important path in life. And we don’t value this so much because we want to get married, because society gives importance to marriages. So it is a ritual of self-love…

Pollo: It´s okay. It´s right what she is saying.

Joshu: But Sasha, do you feel that  marrying yourself shows even more self-love than not marrying oneself … no? Because one can have self-love without marrying oneself, I just say.

Sasha: Yes, totally. Yes, and it’s not necessary need to marry yourself.

Joshu: But you felt even greater self-love when you married yourself?

Sasha: Sorry? Oh, If I feel greater self-love? Yes! Well, because I have the reference of this ring, you see, it is a commitment and it is a symbol. That’s how I can remember it.

Joshu: Yes, you see it and you remember it.

Sasha: Exactly. It´s a symbol that I can remember.

Pollo: I have a question, sorry. Again, I am very very ignorant on the subject …

If one learns how to value yourself and that is why you can marry yourself isn’t it the same learning to say OK, society believes that you have to marry because the canons say that … Anyway, I can be single, alone if I am OK with myself, I do not think it is necessary to marry yourself. And yes, I understand that maybe it is something more from society than something that I really want. Do you understand the point?

Sasha: Yes, it’s not necessary and I’m thinking a lot about this now, at this moment because this idea captured society in Argentina and …

Pollo: Yes, because we have so many problems in our society so this is excellent… It´s like a break within such a big mess… that we say, OK, let´s talk about this!

Sasha: It is something different.

Pollo: Yes. It´s good.

Sasha: I have been thinking about this and I think maybe the people who have experienced abuse in their lives really need a ritual, and understand that can be valuable to do a ritual of self-love, there are people who understand exactly why … and there are people who say why you need to do this? And I think you need to have a calling for self-marriage, it needs to call you, otherwise it’s not right.

Pablo: And the paperwork is the same? You go to the registry office? It´s the same as if you marry someone?

Sasha: I didn’t do that. [I thought he was talking about a wedding registry for presents.] But I could say those are the presents I want, for me it was very quiet. It was more of an internal process, more than an external one.

Yani: And one question… I ask you a question….if you did a whole process of self-worth and self-love because of something in particular, why does it matter to you what society thinks of you because you can easily love yourself. And it´s like a little bit contradictory in the sense that if you love yourself and at some point you don´t care about what the rest thinks, why doing a ritual to show the rest? I don´t know if I’ve made myself clear.

Sasha: I think the point is to talk it out loud, to have witnesses and when I say this to you and you are my friend I promise that I want to follow this path, that I will say no to what is not good for me. I will love myself, I will consider myself beautiful. It’s a memory, the same as a wedding.

Yani: And if you fell in love with someone, for example…. ?

Sasha: It’s all good.

Yani: Can you be unfaithful to yourself?

Sasha: There are no closed doors.

Yani: Ah! Ok, yes.

Boy: In fact, in the end, it ends up being just as marrying with someone else… You are in a relationship right? And the wedding is more symbolic because… you… the love is the same, it wouldn´t change anything theoretically. So….no….

Sasha: It´s something….

Boy: If it changes, it changes, as the lawyer said. Papers change.

Pablo: Well, but…let´s say…. In terms of love… it´s the same.

Pollo: The thing is you shouldn´t marry thinking that you are going to divorce… it´s a great mistake.

Pablo: Yes…

Pollo: Because we should do nothing thinking, Oh, I get on the plane and I have…. And no…. You have to do things and then you…. Have to consider the consequences of what will happen… If you don´t move forward you are a coward I believe….

Yani: Sasha… and when you get to know a new person, right? Now do you tell him look, I am married to myself? No, you don´t tell him?

Juan: For me it’s OK to tell him/her anyway eh…

Sasha: No, it’s fine. When we know each other, but in the first date it would be very weird.

Yani: No, it’s not good.

Sasha: it has to be shared with time, yes, I believe.

(Laughs)

Juan: Why did you choose to marry in Argentina?

Sasha: Because I felt freer here that I have a love for tango. I moved to Buenos Aires because of tango. I have several friends from tango and I feel like the freedom to follow this path here that for me in California, in California I was afraid of my self-marriage being seen as something from Burning Man, I don´t know if you know it.

Pollo: Yes, yes.

Sasha: But it was like I don´t want to be associated with Burning Man. I want to make it authentic, mine.

Juan: Burning Man is that festival that takes place in the desert.

Someone: And what´s the book about?

Sasha: The book is this, that is a word that I invented and it describes the people who want to be with someone and are patient, who can wait for the right person, so in that path, It’s very easy to feel social pressure because you’ve been single for many years so… that word means maybe, if you’ve been single for a long time it´s because you are selective and you are strong so it´s another perspective.

Yani: Did your parents want to kill you because of the self-wedding?

Sasha: (Laughs) No, no no!

Boy: No, no, if your parents…. Like… I don´t know, when you were thirty years old or when you were of a certain age that they made you feel…..

Sasha: Pressure.

Yani:  Pressure. That is why you decided to investigate about the subject or…?

Sasha: No, my parents were always very relaxed about marriage and they wanted me to be happy.

Yani: Ah! OK.

Sasha: I felt the pressure from society. Yes, because I think a girl feels it when she is 12, I felt like “If I have a boyfriend we are more.”

Someone: Yes, that´s true.

Sasha: Yes. It´s like you are pretty or you´re better because you have a boyfriend, why? Maybe you haven´t found the right person.

Pollo: And also, you should see, in connection with this, behind closed doors for both women and men … maybe on the outside it seems excellent and on the inside there’s a hell.

Joshi: Yes, anyway, beyond that also the society…

Juan: Both things, marriage and alone….

Boy:  Now it´s not exactly like that

Pollo: Not anymore.

Yeni: Do you think that today is not exactly like that? At least… For me, to some extent it is.

Sasha: No, yes, yes, it´s still like that. (There is still social pressure to be in a relationship.) I work with those people. I am a coach and that’s one of my specialties.

Pollo: What type of coach are you?

Sasha: A life coach.

Pollo: And what does it mean?

Sasha: It´s kind of a therapist.

Pollo: Yes.

Sasha: But there is more action in it.

Pollo: But… is it for couples? Do you go with your partner?

Sasha: I also have couples because I have couples and they want to build a relationship where no one gets lost.

Pollo: Well, well, wait. Let´s imagine we are in the coach´s office. Can we?

Sasha: Yes! We can.

[Here’s where we start the spontaneous mini-coaching sessions….]

Pollo: Who wants to be treated by the coach? Joshi, Joshi…

Yani: The punishment because he was late.

Pollo: No, but he doesn´t want it… if he doesn´t want.

Yani: It doesn´t matter.

Pollo: We need that before…. Yani, good, perfect…. She´s decided it herself…. I didn´t decide it.

Pablo: Great.

Pollo: Can you come here, Juancito? I haven´t decided it, I swear.

Juan: I liked it more the passive Jeni.

(Laughs)

Pollo: A big round of applause to Yani.

Boy:  Good Yani!

Pollo: Well, are you single, Juan? Well, deal with it yourself.

Pablo: Beautiful!

Pollo: Well, he will do a consultation.

Boy:  Good Yani!

Pollo: Well, are you single, Juan? Well, deal with it yourself.

Pablo: Beautiful!

Pollo: Well, he will do a consultation.

Joshu: Will it be a performance or real life?

Pollo: No, no…. not real life.

Pablo: No, real life never.

Pollo: No, no because otherwise it´s confusing.

Sasha: Are you a client?

Juan: Yes.

Sasha: Very good. I love it.

Juan (sad background music): Sasha… you know, something is happening to me lately and…. And I thought that given my age… I am already 35… I feel that many of my friends are having a family, they are finding their way in life and… I cannot manage to achieve that… I am standing to the other side of it.

Pollo: No, but he is 10 years less than what he said.

Juan: Six less years.

Yani: Don´t interrupt! Leave him…leave him!

Juan: And I feel all of them are finding their way in life… and I am staying sideway of it, but the truth is that I don’t want to force a situation to be in that train that today I feel I am not ready to get on.

Sasha: And… How do you feel about all this? What are your emotions?

Juan: Well, they are contradictory. Sometimes I feel good, I feel comfortable, I have my freedom… but other times, on a rainy Tuesday I feel I would like to have a boy by my side to watch TV.

Sasha: A boy? Or… a girl!

(Laughs)

Someone:  He is a chamuyero.

Pollo: A rainy Tuesday he goes out with an umbrella.

Sasha: Oh! A boy…. Ah….Do you want to be a father?

Pollo: He wants to be a dad to watch TV. But… he wants to be a dad for the rainy Tuesday, if it does not rain on Tuesday we are… No, no, sorry. Continue.

Sasha: And on Wednesday when it rains, you also want a child?

Juan: Yes, until Wednesday.

(Laughs)

Sasha: I want to understand how how strong the desire is. If the desire if very strong.

Juan: It´s contradictory. There are days that it is strong, some days it´s not. There are days that are yes, the desire is strong and the days that are no.

Sasha: And when you feel it in your body, when you connect with yourself?

Juan: For me it´s hard. It´s very hard to connect with myself.

Sasha: Oh, well. Have you thought about marrying yourself?

Pollo: Ah… she is going toward that way.

[Laughs]

Juan: Very good, very good, very good. Come Joshi, I tell you that with Joshi we have… here it´s the truth, now comes the truth… um

Sasha: Oh! Well!

Pollo: A kiss to Joshi´s mum that she always watches us.

Joshi: Ah… kisses!

Joshi: Hi Sasha

Sasha: Hi, how are you?

Joshi: Good.

Sasha: Good?

Joshi: Yes.

Sasha: What do you want to focus on today?

Joshi: Um… the truth is that I don’t have a partner and maybe I feel like something is failing. Am I make myself clear? Like I don´t know very well which way to follow. if keep on like this. Or not.

Sasha: Failing as a woman or failing as what?

Joshi: Life, in life maybe… in general.

Sasha: In life…

Joshi: Yes.

Sasha: And is it something you really want, the relationship?

Joshi: It happens to me that sometimes yes, too much. And sometimes no. I am in a dichotomy like… Sometimes I cry, sometimes I smile.

Sasha: And what do you feel most of the time?

Joshi: Most of the time? Um… I am confused, Sasha.

Sasha: And… have you thought about marrying yourself?

Pollo: It´s OK, it´s OK.

(Laughs)

Sasha: That is the solution.

Someone: That is the solution.

Joshu: Mmm…. Yes, I have thought about that.

Sasha: Oh, yes? Do you have vows? Have you thought about vows with yourself? (In Spanish, this word sounds like Botox)

Someone: Not Botox, vows.

Sasha: No! Vows.

Someone: The granola won´t be shared if she marries herself.

Joshi: Vows… um… yes, yes. I thought… I feel that I would be a great partner for myself.

Sasha: What would you like to promise to yourself?

Joshi:  Eternal loyalty. I mean, that to begin with. Um…. Love, love.

Sasha: Love to yourself.

Joshi: Yes, love to myself. It´s weird how it sounds but…

Someone: It´s OK, it´s OK.

Sasha: And how do you express that love? How would you like to?

Joshi: I take care of myself, I do skin treatments…

Someone(boy): Me too…

Joshi: And that is self-love… and I take care of myself a lot.

Sasha: What would you like to tell yourself so that you love yourself? What your internal dialogue would be? What would you say?

Joshi: Like… a mantra to myself?

Sasha: Yes.

Joshi: Uf… Maybe I would repeat it all the time like… “How pretty you are!”

Sasha: That´s good!

Pollo: It´s fine!

Juan: It´s fine.

Pollo: It´s fine!

Sasha: I like it, I like it… it´s very soft.

Pollo: Excellent, excellent!

Pablo: I am beginning to think that Joshi uses all specialists who come so in real life she doesn’t pay the real ones.

Pollo: The last thing I ask you, obviously. Is it in the bookstore this book (Quirkyalone)?

Sasha: Well, today I emailed my agent to say we have to sell the rights to an Argentine publisher because there is a lot of interest now.

Pollo: OK.

Sasha: There is a translated book in Brasil (SoSingular), of this book but in version, but we don´t have it yet in Argentina.

Pollo: Well, but, look… there is it, there is your instagram so that they can ask you questions there.

Sasha: Perfect.

Pollo: Two more things before we go. I would like that with this vision of a woman with a more open mind that at least, from the people we are here. You tell me who here you believe is closest to marry himself or herself… I mean… Who of all of us, from the little you have seen us… you say… which goes that way to marry him or herself… Who do you think?

Sasha: Oh. Him! (Pointing at Juan.)

Juan: Come on Juan! You have found the love of your life.

Pollo: He does not make good coffee.

Pollo: And the last thing I say… It has nothing to do with this but I would like you to answer this. If you had to … This is an intuition, it´s almost a prejudice… Who do you believe…. From all the people who are here, maybe nobody but…Who likes men and women? Who likes people … who does not care about gender?

Sasha: Ah…you mean bisexual?

Pollo: Bisexual… who? Who? Who do you think? I want to know.

Someone(boy): Come on Sasha! Say it! It´s just a question.

Sasha: Those two. (Pointing at Yani and the other boy, Pablo)

Pollo: Those two!

(Laughs)

Pablo: It´s OK, yes, it might be… A big round of applause to Sasha!

Juan: Sasha, thanks!

Pollo: Wait, are you staying in Argentina?

Sasha: Sorry?

Pollo: Are you staying here in Argentina?

Sasha: Yes, I am finishing my next book here. This is my commitment.

Pollo: Well, dance lot of tango. Go to the new Corrientes Avenue that it is very nice.

Sasha: A place?

Pollo: Corrientes Avenue is the new avenue. It´s called Corrientes. It´s excellent… it´s very nice and they encourage people to marry themselves.

Pablo: People who dance tango are very… chamuyeros, be careful.

Sasha: Super chamuyeros.

Joshi: Do you feel Argentines are chamuyeros?

Sasha: I don´t know about all Argentines, but yes…. It´s a talent. (Note: Being a chamuyero means being a smooth-talking bullshitter.)

Joshi: Here we have three talents.

Juan: She is saying because of the three over there.

Pollo: I have lost timing a little bit, but I can come back. No, I won´t come back but….

Yani: That you don´t lose…

Joshi: It is never lost.

Joshi: It is never lost…It´s like riding a bicycle….

Yani: Exactly. It´s like riding the bicycle.

Pollo: You don´t lose the timing? I haven´t tried it anyway but….

Yani: Pablito, we have confused, he is not chamuyero because he has just tried and he failed…

Pollo: No, Pablo, really, he should be among the most boring guys that exist… really, um… I am not joking.

(To Sasha) Thanks, it´s kind of you.

Sasha: Well, thanks.

Photos by Julia Ribeiro. Translation by Lucila Soros with help from Kat Ananda.

***

Want to see the news clip that kicked off this media madness on TeleNoche? Watch the TeleNoche interview (and read the English translation) of that possibly even more hilarious interview here.

Want to be guided in the process of marrying yourself whether you are single or already married? After all, you are the only one you are certain to be with for your entire life. You saw me give some coaching here so you might feel called to reach out! Go here to learn more about my coaching and to request a coaching consult.

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